Making movies, singing songs

Michael Sosebee has generously provided the presentation I delivered in on the University of Arizona campus in November 2011. He shot all the footage, a portion of which is embedded below. Also embedded below is a song inspired by my writing and speaking, and also including a few of my words (the song is not suitable for work, youngsters, or people averse to swearing).


My latest essay for Transition Voice was published yesterday. Adapted and shortened from an essay in this space, it’s here.


I’d like to think this space is a positive community that fosters discussion and learning. Asking honest questions is always encouraged. I expect civility in interactions and will tolerate absolutely no hate speech.

Comments 124

  • drill baby drill
    kill baby kill

    I wish the camera was pointed at the audience so we could see their faces!

    There will be no gentle transition from 7 billion to 500 million – are you kidding me? Picture the world on fire.

  • Great tune!

    I remember so many things when I reflect on my own journey…

    ~ In 1979 I was studying Biology at the University of Vermont, and learning about air & water pollution, and as a class exercise calculated the carrying capacity of the Earth as ~1.8 billion…
    ~ In August, 2001 my son, then just 20, joined the VT National Guard in a spectacular example of bad timing. He remembered the Guard’s role in the spectacular ice storms in 1998, and wanted to be part of all that… 3 Weeks later the super-comfy bubble of privilege and hubris we Americans were raised to enjoy — and expect — was turned on its ear. My grey roots bloomed like crocuses in April… What does an anti-war protester do when his son joins the army? MFSO, anyone?
    ~ In 2003 I had decided to make wholesale changes in my life as my dad was dying lung cancer, and my wife and I decided to sell our suburban, heated-by-oil house, and do everything we could to get off our own addiction to oil, grow our own food, and live as lightly on the planet as we could.
    ~ The light suddenly went off about Peak Oil on August 29th, 2005, when I saw End Of Suburbia as Hurricane Katrina was slamming into New Orleans, and our plans went from tentative to urgent.
    ~ After 2 years of trying to raise awareness of Peak Oil, we were seriously burned out. I found refuge in the Transition Movement, and found a way to be hopeful and excited about building a better future through relocalization, downsizing, and energy descent
    ~ I was convinced all we had to do was stop breeding like bunnies, and show people a better way to live with more manual labor, fewer electronic do-dads, more clay bread ovens and root cellars, and raise awareness of the urgency of starting our energy descent plan for a soft landing…
    ~ Climate Change seemed like just one of those three parts of the still-avoidable perfect storm of human misery & suffering (along with Peak Oil and Overpopulation).
    ~ Then I discovered NBL, and well, the past is history. What to do NOW, we ask.
    ~ On Easter Sunday we found out our son and Daughter-in-law are pregnant, and July 28th is the due date of our first grand-child …a little boy, we found out a few weeks ago. What a strange mix of joy and dread, excitement and concern.

    And where do we go from here? I’ll continue to work on my Permaculture Design, my Hugelkultur beds, building my chicken coop, and learning how to use our root cellar… it’s still one foot in front of the other, but I gotta say, the anguished hours I’ve spent working on taxes over the past 2 weeks really seems so pointless. I used to contemplate war tax resistance, but that just doesn’t seem to go far enough!

  • HA! Just realized something…

    I decided to attend UVM in 1978 for biology instead of UA for Astronomy… As an astronomy major and active amateur telescope maker, I might have become a professional telescope maker, and might be working right beneath that very football stadium with Roger Angel, spin-casting huge telescope mirrors…

    Just think, I would have met Guy 20 years ago!

    Huh — small world. Glad I’m not in Tucson for the big show … somehow I think northern VT is a “better” place, but what the hell does THAT mean anymore? Looks like the end is coming wherever we are, so maybe being more vulnerable, and among the first to go over the edge is actually better. Only time will tell.

  • this is what we are dealing with:

    Westboro Baptist Church stated today that “Massachusetts invited this special wrath from God Almighty when it was the first state to pass same-sex marriage on May 17, 2004.”

    Please help us make sure none of these nut-jobs get through the bottleneck.

    The Collapse of Industrial Civilization. It’s a race between economic collapse and environmental collapse.

    From Mac Salvo:

    Consider what happens when someone loses their income stream. As a result, they are unable to pay their mortgage, put food on the table or live any semblance of the life they came to know while they were gainfully employed.

    Our government, like any individual American, also has an income stream. That income is based on taxes, and in recent years, overwhelming borrowing. In the near future we will reach a point where we’ve taken on so much debt that our creditors will no longer lend us money. Because tax revenues are already dropping due to negative economic growth, the government will essentially be left with no income.

    Like someone who loses their job, they will have no way of meeting their monthly obligations. They won’t be able to provide nutritional assistance, there will be no health care, and social security benefits will stop being distributed.

    Our civilization would not be able to handle such a transition from an expansionary credit based economy where goods and services were readily available into a paradigm of credit contraction, supply shortages and destitution.

    This is what is coming. There is no way to prevent – only to defer it until a later date.

    That day will soon be upon us, and one way or the other life in America as we have come to know it will take a drastic turn for the worse. When civilizations transform in this way it often results in violence, starvation and bloodshed. Prepare for it, because it will be on our doorsteps soon enough.

  • Perhaps you heard about this.Your tax dollars at work. Ohio has a program (HEAP)that had to use it’s heating surplus up from the mild 2012 winter.Instead of saving it for next winter, they gave vouchers out for AC units at $250 a pop.The AC units are made by a Korean company. To qualify your income must be below $46,100 for a family of four.

    Menwhile, the Park Service posts signs that say “Please do not feed the animals” Why? They will become dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves.

  • A beautiful movie, and a stunning essay (neither mine, both pilfered!)

  • @ Rob: How very sad. The same insulation that keeps us warm in winter will help keep us cool in the summer. To throw that money at AC units instead of weatherization (I’d prefer deep energy retrofits) is such a stupid waste of money.

    Our current energy bill In Vermont would require an energy audit and place buildings on a priority list for weatherization if the occupants qualify for LIHEAP (low income heating energy assistance program), but there is no guarantee it will be passed, or survive with that provision intact. Ideally, we’d try to stop the bleeding instead of providing more Band-Aids, but we are not always so wise… that’s why we’re in this mess to begin with.

  • I had a meeting with the newly-appointed senior water officer for my local council this morning (NZ time). Nice chap, completely locked in to techno-fundamentalism and incremental ‘improvement’, of course.

    I pointed out to him that the entire system was unsustainable (giving the frequently-discussed reasons) and would collapse some time in the next 10 to 20 years, possibly a lot sooner than that. also I pointed out that everything -well 99%- that the council did made matters worse, and that everything he regarded as normal was a short term aberration.

    Amongst other tings, I said: “Humans actually should be living naked in jungles.”

    He said: “How long do you think humans would survive living that way?”

    I said: “About 2 million years.”

  • criticism first: this time i’m nailing guy (hah?) (i need a new keyboard. the exclamation mark on this one isn’t working, or i’d put one in next to the question mark) for dogmatic optimism with the last statement of his in the song NATURE BATS LAST. in the face of ecological collapse and nte for most if not all gaian life, ‘the living planet’ is not about to make a comeback. with luck, maybe millions of years from now. (or maybe that wouldn’t be lucky if indeed ‘life is suffering’)

    guy, u r da man(exclamation point X2) u’re attracting a passionate and talented following in sheeple like afrizen and mike sosebee. slowly but surely, the word is getting out (to the few who can appreciate it).

    good little film clip (best short one yet, imo) and great song. i hope it becomes a cult hit, gains a cult following. i’ll send it to a few friends. loved it.

    reading nbl daily is a unique experience also.

  • @Brad Vietje, do you have a straw-bale home? I’ve been in touch with Ben Graham and I think I might have seen your name and home project through some site connected with him. We are interested in a similar project. Thanks for sharing your story here.

    I just heard in passing that VT is #1 for access to locally-produced food, and that accessibility is a big reason why we moved here last year. I’m in central VT, Randolph…

    I haven’t read the bill you are talking about but I’m increasingly skeptical about gov’t. incentives. In our own case how the current efficiency-promotion scheme worked out is that you can apparently only get credit IF your taxable income is high enough, IF they haven’t run out of money already, and IF you are a PAST customer of Green Mtn. Power and not one of the residences taken over from Central Vt. power something (which happened before we even bought our house but which disqualified us from the efficiency-improvement money pool). Up to this point it has seemed like a giant make-work project for bureaucrats. We had a full-scale energy audit, and some woman out of Efficiency Vermont spent who-knows-how-long doing a detailed assessment of our proposed improvements projecting a rebate of thousands, and in the end we got nothing in offsets at all. I believe our energy-retrofit contractor has a lot of integrity, but even he got sucked into trying to sell us a ~$10k(IIRC) electric heating/cooling unit, since that’s what the industry/gooberment seems to be pushing (again with tantalizing “rebates”). Our insulation is pretty-much maxed out now after the retrofit, but we haven’t decided on the merit of the heat pump yet.

    Maybe I am just too cynical, for example seeing the “Energy Star” push as a way to sell new appliances that people largely don’t need, trying to stimulate consumer demand in a contracting economy. Rob’s report (above), though, certainly doesn’t give me reason to modify my opinion: energy companies want to sell energy and their partnerships with gov. in these sorts of programs are not really designed to reduce energy use as far as I can see. They are well-aware of Jevon’s paradox, whereas the average low-income Ohio person just sees “hey, a cheap AC!”. This seems immoral to me, like printer companies selling below-cost printers so they can then sell you the toner, or drug dealers getting you hooked with a cheap fix.

    My contractor has to push what Efficiency VT is pushing, otherwise he loses his “accreditation”, or “certification”, or whatever, with them as an energy auditor! They’ve got people coming and going, I tell ya’…!

    On another day, I may share with the group my brief experience with this incoherent outfit, funded by HUD:
    Gotta scan their handout (not on their site) and put it up on Scribd; it’s a laugh riot.

  • I loved it. Right to the point. I am living in Reno and things seem to be imploding here. I have seen at least 6-10 businesses close since the beginning of the year. I have a student loan that i cannot pay. I am just waiting for the other shoe to fall. Frustrated since people are ignorant and do not want to hear the truth but they want to live in fairytale land.

  • the virgin terry says: …if indeed ‘life is suffering’

    The Buddha made clear what we’ve got:
    Suffering—that is our lot;
    Based on things that I’d see
    And what happened to me,
    I’m no one to say that it’s not.

  • Guy: given everything you (and we here) have been discussing for the last several months, how is the planet gonna support even 500 million? Aren’t we talking “extinction”in about 20 years? With major calamities well before then, since it won’t simply be OK till 1/1/31 and then suddenly go to extinction in a matter of months.

  • Kevin Moore:
    Keep in mind that your earnest efforts with the hierarchy/bureaucracy are at least as much to fulfil an inner need as to contribute to the common weal. But from what you report, the likelihood of making an effect on that common weal is slim to none.

    And yes, you are right, in our natural state we are a very tropical species. Anyplace we need protective clothing and shelter from the elements, we are using technology to extend our habitable range, and are the (one and only) technologically invasive species. We have not had enough evolutionary time to biologically adapt to environments outside the tropics, like have the tropical elephants to the form of wooly mammoths, the camel to the forms of the cooler and mountainous llama, guanaco, alpaca and the vicuña. Or the bear as the polar bear.

    the virgin terry:
    You may be able to get a keyboard mighty cheap at a Big Lots or similar store in your area. Not necessarily very durable. They don’t have everything all the time, so one has to be on the lookout for what they drag in from each batch of “industrial roadkill”. Another option is to pry off the plastic cap on the malfunctioning key and fixing the contacts. I think I saw a YouTube video many moons ago on how to hack keyboards.

    NBL folks that entertain a hope of averting NTE might see themselves in a herd in full stampede towards the cliff. A slender chance of avoiding the worst by manoeuvring out of the herd. But others might see the equivalent of an imminent asteroid strike. If the last big one did not clear the slate for us, there may perhaps have been an intelligent species of dinosaurs many millions of years ago – perhaps taking the planet (and us) into NTE a couple of hundred millennia after their first appearance. Us in that case being us persistently shrew-like (and not in the Shakespearean sense) still scampering through the underbrush and in the trees. No way of predicting the consequences in Deep Time.

  • Hey Lidia,

    Yup — that’s me… straw bale dwelling, solar energy geek from Newbury, VT… fancy running into someone here who is not only from Central VT, but knows of me through mutual friends! Ben was brought in to do our bale walls, and save us from our first contractor; long story — glad we found Ben and Ace & Deva! I just drove past a house where Ben is working this afternoon, and considered stopping in to say hello — I didn’t — and it occurred to me to ask him if he was familiar with Guy’s work and NBL just a few hours ago… very small world, indeed!

    Feel free to contact me off-list: greenworksvt – at – gmail – dot – com (foolishly trusting that people won’t scam and spam the hell out of me here….) If you are considering having BFG work with you on your house, I couldn’t recommend him highly enough. Or, we could just complain about EVT and other government functionaries…

    I’ve got to check in and see what’s happening at Transition Vermont — haven’t been there in a while.

    Clear skies,


  • __________________

    The Enigma We Answer by Living

    Einstein didn’t speak as a child
    waiting till a sentence formed and
    emerged full-blown from his head.

    I do the thing, he later wrote, which
    nature drives me to do. Does a fish
    know the water in which he swims?

    This came up in conversation
    with a man I met by chance,
    friend of a friend of a friend,

    who passed through town carrying
    three specimen boxes of insects
    he’d collected in the Grand Canyon—

    one for mosquitoes, one for honeybees,
    one for butterflies and skippers,
    each lined up in a row, pinned and labeled,

    tiny morphologic differences
    revealing how adaptation
    happened over time. The deeper down

    he hiked, the older the rock
    and the younger
    the strategy for living in that place.

    And in my dining room the universe
    found its way into this man
    bent on cataloguing each innovation,

    though he knows it will all disappear—
    the labels, the skippers, the canyon.
    We agreed then, the old friends and the new,

    that it’s wrong to think people are a thing apart
    from the whole, as if we’d sprung
    from an idea out in space, rather than emerging

    from the sequenced larval mess of creation
    that binds us with the others,
    all playing the endgame of a beautiful planet

    that’s made us want to name
    each thing and try to tell
    its story against the vanishing.

    ~ Alison Hawthorne Deming ~

    (Genius Loci)

  • This seems to fit the discussion. Is this why NBL is not moderated?

  • We are 2 weeks late planting crops. It keeps raining. We will not plant until it stops…ever. We wait. Farming is a dance with nature, or should be. I started out with the idea of controling things. But as time went on I found it’s easier if you work with rather than against nature. I contribute only a little. For the most part, I am helpless. It is foolish to think we can control this natural system. We take what we get. I’m interested in what we are likely to get. NBL is my weather station…longer term. The weather fronts are moving slowly. Have been all year.

  • Robin Datta.

    I do the council stuff because it is way of keeping my brain alive and it is a way of getting a trickle of truth into the swamp of lies.

    Eventually something or someone breaks.

    Three years ago I gave up in despair when a councillor I had been working on had not read the information I provided him with. The usual excuse of ‘too busy’. Three years later he has read my most recent book (TEW, 2011) and recently commented: “Brilliant.” We now have regular discussions and are working on strategies to ‘bring down to Orcs’ who are in control at the moment.

    There can never be hope of turning anything around at this stage, of course, but as I said to the council water services manager this morning, we have a choice between a managed transition to more sane arrangements, or attempting to prop up dysfunctional arrangements for as long as possible and then experiencing a mighty collapse.

    My analogy for the day is using what fuel we have on a plane to bring it safely to ground, or using that fuel to keep it high in the sky for as long as possible and then crashing to the ground.

    For some perverse reason most people still choose the second option.

  • @ dmd

    For you, the way to get free energy…

  • George Orwell, ‘1984’. Winston, thinking about the proles, wrote:

    Until they become conscious they will never rebel, and until they have rebelled they cannot become conscious.

  • Just viewed JRS in a 2012 lecture here on democracy and economics gone way wrong. I can recommend it because it outs the common good at the centre of human life, without forgetting the environment:

    ‘John Ralston Saul: It’s Broke how Can We Fix It?’


    “A long-term champion of freedom of expression, watch John Ralston Saul in intimate conversation on the state of the world today; from economic stability, unemployment and poverty to inequality, racism, terrorism and fundamentalism.”

    Kathy C

    Thanks for the info on Humanure.

  • I have been looking at other “doom” forums and I was surprised at the spectrum. There are actually conservative, right wing, doom sites! They are mainly focused on the economic collapse of America – ranting about 2nd Amendment, Obama and Obamacare, Illuminati, Federal REserve, etc. Funny, if you read closely, you can see some common threads. There is a definite common thread in that they hate the Banksters, the Wall Street folks, etc. Just like OWS. Of course, if they had their way, they would form their own libertarian country and nobody from OWS would be invited – how ironic.

    I think it would be interesting to get the OWS folks and the right wing militia folks to participate in a national convention!

  • KPFA is Pacifica Network’s flagship radio station, in Berkeley, California, celebrating its 64th birthday. Its Morning Mix (8-9AM) Wed host has been JR Valrey, “information minister” for the Black Panther Party. He was recently suspended for criticizing station honcho Sasha Lilley, co-authoer of a new book titled Catastrophism, which attacks perspectives such as NTE and just about everything that NBL stands for. But he didn’t criticize her for that, but for …. being white.

    So what replaced him today? A program which sounds like it was created by the Gates Foundation, Life in 2030, which makes Lilley and her ilk look like radical Luddites. The future which be powered by space based solar stations, robots will be all around us, we’ll have smart clothes, smart cars, nanotechnology in everything,…. Guess what: not a single word about climate change, Peak Oil, resources shortages, economic crisis,….. Narrated by people who sound like part robots. Amazing!
    If you wanna check it out, go to and find it under today’s date, 8-9AM local time. I’ve never heard anything so techno-optimistic even on mainstream media.

  • John Ralston Saul, omg! He spoke here at this university last year and I was alternating between laughing and crying and being totally amazed at this man’s insights.

    I have several of his books, but the one that just blew my mind was “The End of Globalism.” In the link above he updates what he said in that book and makes you think it’s funny while he’s at it.

    I lent that book to a friend and he gave it back after reading a few pages, saying, “Well, he’s just a smarty pants, isn’t he?”

    The only presentation at our university that impressed me more was Wade Davis.

  • seems the discussion today has a paucity of worthy topics!

    Guy, you need to post something more inspiring!

    I keep thinking of “going out with a bang” but I’m too stuck in my mundane everyday life.

  • I don’t think Mike Sosebee is on board with NTE, in fact, I don’t know what he is adding to the “cause.”

  • @DMD says “I started out with the idea of controlling things. But as time went on I found it’s easier if you work with rather than against nature.”

    Years ago, when we really started ramping up our backyard farm, I started looking at different sources of information with respect to commercial agriculture.

    It seems ironic, but while the vast majority of gardening **information** is devoted towards organic methods, the vast majority of resources available at most gardening stores are still geared towards good old NPK chemical fertilizers.

    What I discovered, and this will come as no surprise to Dave and others, is that many (most) commercial growers consider soil nothing more than a growing medium, a mere substrate in which to support root growth & plant structure. Water & nutrients are delivered to plants under controlled metering, with an abundance of herbicides, insecticides, fungicides, and all other manner of ‘cides’.

    Once I understood their position, I was able to compare & contrast it to all the other various methods being championed such as strait organic, aquaponics, hydroponics, etc. After doing a lot of research and running the numbers, it finally dawned on me why/how successful commercial growers approached food production the way they do: it works.

    All the other methods have way too much overhead, are way too complicated, they can suffer catastrophic losses and many times, they also happen to be heavy energy users (especially electricity to run all the pumps).

    So what’s the point? The point is, food is still reliably being delivered to stores 24/7 with 100% saturation across the USA. Other than tiny “non-serious” players, this food is produced by big operators using the methods mentioned above: soil as a substrate, with water & nutrients delivered with practically no regard to the health of the medium.

    The problem with becoming more informed, is no matter how well intentioned one might be, when you really begin to look into how our entire way of life operates, it’s hard not to draw the obvious conclusions discussed @ NBL.

    Our way of life isn’t just some random ‘wrong’ turn, but a long, long drawn out process that will prove impossible to change/alter/rectify. When people see comments/observations from Dave, they should be taking notes: this is front-line information on what it takes to succeed in his business. There are no alternatives to the status quo, and for those who try, they will simply end up tired & broke(n).

  • melissa, why do you question Mike Sosebee’s motives? Why do you question anybody’s motives? Are your motives and actions pure beyond questioning?

  • BC Nurse Prof

    I am reading John Ralston Saul’s ‘The unconscious Civilisation’, which was published in 1995.

    In it he draws from the 1970’s shift(peak oil in the US), to both globalisation and the financialisation of Developed economies, and warns these are in part co-demisers of true democratic. His main argument is that with regard to democracy it requires participation and a quote here is very pertinent as to his reasons why most do not participate:

    “What then is the great leap backwards announced in the title of this chapter? It is our leap into the unconscious state beloved of the subject who, existing as a functioning any one of the tens of thousands of corporations – public and private – is relieved of personal, disinterested responsibility for his society. He thus gives in to the easy temptation embracing what I can only call the passive certitude offered by every ideology.” pg. 37.

    His central idea is that vigorous debate and public conversations about how to run the show are adult concerns, but most have been convinced to go backwards into childhood and be occupied with trinkets and screens and let others do the running, or management.

    A lot more to tis than that, but it interests me because he and others saw it coming(1995), and he was right. In the link I put above (2012), he also talks about the environmental movement failing because it did not go directly to engage power, it went into NGO and such and just tried to ‘influence’ power – a victory by stealth for TPTB.
    Anyway, it is another confirmations that returning to anarchy, as Guy has proposed is a way of entering a scalable democratic direct relation with the power structures that impact on your life, and the environment we all can love.

  • From New Scientist..

    Extinction debt suggests endangered species are doomed

    15:16 17 April 2013 by Fred Pearce
    For similar stories, visit the Endangered Species Topic Guide
    From dragonflies to bears, when it comes to lost species we ain’t seen nothing yet.

    Biologists are getting rattled about growing evidence of “extinction debt” – the idea that there is a delay of decades or even centuries between humans damaging ecosystems and the demise of species that live there.

    In the largest extinction debt study to date, Stefan Dullinger of the University of Vienna, Austria, ranked 22 European countries according to the proportion of domestic species classed as endangered in the year 2000. He then ranked them for the amount of pressure put on nature in the years 2000, 1950 and 1900 – as measured by population density, per-capita GDP and intensity of land use.

    He found that the countries with the most recent extinctions were the ones that put the most pressure on their ecosystems in 1900; pressures applied in 2000 had little bearing.

    The upshot is that today’s extinctions may be the result of damage we did in the early 20th century; our own extinction legacy could ultimately be far worse.

    Feeling the heat

    Dullinger found that small species with short lifespans, such as dragonflies and grasshoppers, are only just feeling the effects of human pressures applied in 1900. The time lag for mammals is shorter – many species are feeling the heat from our actions in the 1950s. This could be because insects can survive in small fragments of natural habitat, says Dullinger, whereas larger species need bigger areas of undisturbed terrain.

    One explanation for the findings would be that countries are now better at protecting species. But Dullinger found that the time lag persisted even when he factored investment in environmental projects into his rankings. “The conclusion is clear,” he says. “Biodiversity takes its time to respond to socio-economic pressures.”

    This extinction debt could mean that many endangered species are already doomed. The one hope, says Oliver Wearn of Imperial College London, is that predicting likely extinctions could focus “conservation efforts in areas with the greatest debt”.

  • John Ralston Saul’s “Voltaire’s Bastards” definitely in my top ten list.

  • @OzMan

    Thank you for the John Ralston Saul link to the Sydney talk. He has been years ahead most people and leaders in projecting the demise of “market-driven democracies”. What a shame and loss for us that his thinking wasn’t recognized sooner. Here’s a great quote from his Sydney talk:

    “Today I can only ask, when did saving a bank become more important than saving a country? When did our academic social scientists begin to believe that the source of legitimacy in a democracy was not the citizenry, but commercial contracts? Why save banks that hold mortgages? Why not give the money to the citizens who have mortgages?”

    He’s very good at articulating how the control of societies are shaped/controlled by market based powers leaving the concerns with society and earth to those he calls influencers, like NGOs, who really have no power.

  • @OzMan and Carmen, I haven’t read/watched anything from Mr. Saul as of yet. I’ve just heard of him today. But catching up on my “C-Realm” podcasts I came across a pretty interesting exposition of historical underpinnings for corporate control in America… not a new thing in the least. The interviewee, Paul Cienfuegos, openly calls our “revered” Constitution the result of a coup, perverting the vision of the earlier Confederation. Also called into question is the very legitimacy of a Supreme Court, which rules in favor of corporations almost exclusively and in the process effectively writes law, it seems. Non-democratically, we shouldn’t need to precise…

  • More on the Antarctic – Artic link..

    The Antarctic Half of the Global Thermohaline Circulation Is Faltering

  • @ Lidia

    I have worked fairly extensively with Paul Cienfuegos in attempting to get the Community Rights(CR)movement off the ground here in Portland where he now resides.

    About two years ago, I was convinced that this was the best avenue for the Occupy movement to be channeled into. There was an amazing groundswell of support in finding a way as to how localities could establish a degree of regional autonomy, in light of massive banking and political fraud. The iron was hot, and many of us knew we had to strike while everyone was watching the greatest anarchist movement in a lifetime play out around the world.

    In theory, I still do support the effort. However, in practice, where even in a highly charged and politically aware city like Portland, Oregon CR has just withered like every other alternative, and has languished in complete irrelevancy for years now. By the time the locus of a movement finds itself in the back rooms of leftist book stores, or the moldy basements of catholic churches, it’s the sign of a long slow death.

    Not to rain on anyone’s parade, but this is NBL after all, and we’re all use to being drenched, but the societal impediments to CR is just insurmountable. It fundamentally requires a level of citizen awareness and participation that simply doesn’t exist, if it ever has. And believe me, I put in an enormous amount of time in getting the word out. Without this critical aspect CR can never gain traction. But with that said, rural Pennsylvanians have made remarkable inroads, and their story is quite inspiring, so is the Nestle water right issue in Maine.

    It’s an incredibly radical concept. Again, in theory it’s quite simple, where we seek to establish a crisis of jurisdiction between State and Federal law through “Community Bills of Rights”, where we seek to pass any number of local ordinances that overrides both State and Federal law. However, any movement that first requires it’s supporters to take up to several days of educational classes (what is known as democracy school) just to understand the history of corporate rights, is sadly doomed right out of the gate.

    Even though I considered Occupy to be too little too soon, but as a lifelong anarchist, I morally couldn’t just sit on my laurels and do nothing. But Occupy is what finally broke me. We are just too divided as a species to ever change the course we’re on. It’s solely a personal choice at this point. We can resist because we are driven by a moral imperative, but if anyone thinks we can even remotely challenge either the ruling elite or even our own entrenched indifference is just fooling themselves at this point. Take it from a life long fool.

    But then again, in the face of NTE, what difference does it make how we fool ourselves. There are a thousand ways to go out with a bang!if one is so inclined……..

  • @ Bailey

    And what that MIGHT lead to…

    It is believed[2] oceanic anoxic events are strongly linked to lapses in key oceanic current circulations, to climate warming and greenhouse gases.

  • Daniel wrote:
    ” We are just too divided as a species to ever change the course we’re on.”

    The Dynamic Constant of Doom



  • America is a third-world country. As much as $1B in illegally traded domestic wood is poached every year. From the Olympic peninsula:

    “What you have out here now is a gold-rush mentality,” says Freed. Referring to the maple-tree thieves, Freed postulates, “They’re society’s dropouts. They work without a net. The same guy who is taking down these trees is poaching salmon and killing elk out of season. But, I’ll tell you what—yeah, they got issues with meth and so on, but they are the greatest capitalists in the world.”

    Van Orman is less charitable: “I call them crankster gangsters.”

  • Animal, marine life and bird deaths are getting ridiculously large and much more frequent:

    Thousands of animals have been mysteriously dying in China over the past few weeks, with 410 pigs, 122 dogs, and other domestic animals in Dongtun village, Henan Province, added to the list on Monday.

    Dead dogs were reported to be piled on the sides of the streets, and residents said many of the surviving animals are ill. Numerous cats died, and even dead rats were found.

    “There are more than 300 pigs on my pig farm; nearly 200 died, and the rest are dying,” said a villager called Mr. Song, according to a report by the Dahe Daily.

    Local authorities are investigating the cause of the deaths, and tests have ruled out the new H7N9 bird flu virus, which has reportedly infected 77 people and killed 16 to date.

    Instead, locals suspect that the deaths are due to noxious fumes from a nearby chemical plant. The plant has temporarily stopped production, although officials said air quality tests had not revealed any dangerous chemicals.

    “There is always a smell, but this morning it was unbearably strong and repulsive,” a local resident told the Dahe Daily.

    The plant makes pharmaceutical products, and has been in operation for over 10 years. Residents have repeatedly complained about the environmental pollution, but without results.

    In the past two years, the emissions got worse and many locals have been suffering physical symptoms. “The gas makes people feel dizzy, and hurts our throats. Many people in the village died of cancer between the ages of 30 and 50” a resident said, according to the Daily.

    A reporter with Henan Business Daily said he saw a dozen walnut trees next to a pig farm with darkened wilting leaves, and a lot of the local residents had swollen throats.

    A security guard at the chemical plant stopped the reporter from entering. He had apparently received an order from upper management, and said, “The unreal reports by the media had damaged the factory’s credibility.”

    A Weibo blogger said: “410 pigs died overnight, 122 dogs died for no reason, the birds fell down while they were flying, the hedgehogs just stopped crawling … and the factory claimed that the unreal reports damaged its reputation …”

    Another joked: “The tests did not find any harmful chemicals in air samples from the village, so the animals died of being investigated for corruption?”

    The carcasses are being disposed of in a remote area by burying them in a deep pit sprayed with lime.

    Other recent mass animal deaths in China include 16,000 pig carcasses dumped in Shanghai’s Huangpu River, hundreds of pounds of dead fish in Shanghai and Beijing, and dead wild birds in Jiangsu, Hubei, and Sichuan provinces.

    Add to this diseased oysters in Australia (Port Stephens and Hawkesbury River), (~5) thousands of swallows in Vietnam, the hundreds of sick sea lion (pups) in southern California, a few more whales washing up recently, all the H7N9 bird flu spreading in China, besides all the poaching of rhinos and elephants (even in zoos and museums!) and now this from this morning (from Monday):

    More than 12,000 birds crashed in Utah’s west desert Monday

    The number of eared grebes rescued — and killed — after their Monday crash-landings at the U.S. Army’s Dugway Proving Ground was far higher than originally estimated.

    Wildlife biologists and volunteers spent Monday and Tuesday gathering 12,800 water birds, carrying the 7,828 surviving birds by pickup trucks to ponds in the region.

    The birds were migrating back to the Great Salt Lake for the summer, but apparently became disoriented by snow and fog and mistook wet roads and parking lots for water. Built for water, with legs far to the back of their bodies, they can lift off from the ground only with great difficulty.

    An estimated 100 birds were taken to rehabilitation facilities, Dugway spokeswoman Paula Thomas said.

    Biologists working under a permit from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service were burning and burying the birds that died or were so seriously injured they had to be euthanized.

    Of course with all the radiation being dumped daily into the Pacific Ocean and into the air from Fukushima (what, did you think it was over?) i’m sure it’s only going to get worse. There’s no telling how it’s effecting people all over the world yet, but it should lead to more birth defects, cancer, and other diseases as time goes on.

    Stay tuned.

  • I’m sure the FBI is monitoring the traffic on all the doom sites, whether they are “environmental whackos” with left leaning tendencies or anti-government right-wing extremists. They probably have all our IP addresses and know where we live, where we work, etc. They probably know how many guns we have, how much ammo we have, etc.

    Those of us who are Collapse Aware and, even further, NTE Aware, are a real threat to whatever plan they may have for THEIR SURVIVAL. Whether we are left-leaning or right-leaning, atheists or Christians, anarchists or libertarians, we oppose the status quo.

    A slow-moving collapse benefits the status quo – they can match pace and slowly ramp up their plans for control/disposal of the masses. Any opposition that becomes too organized can be destroyed quite easily. After all, TPTB have tanks and B-1 bombers!, not to mention psych ops, black ops, and a massive force already on the ground ready to act: military personnel, police, DHS, FEMA, TSA, etc. These forces only get stronger each day.

    Happy Earth Day!

    On Earth Day – April 22 – the Face of Climate Change will show itself at thousands of events around the world. In Washington DC, the Kehila Chadasha congregation will host a speaker in honor of Earth Day. Karen Sack—director of International Ocean Conservation for the Pew Environment Group—will speak about the state of the oceans, including her role in preventing overfishing in Europe, protecting sharks and other marine life, establishing large-scale marine reserves, and combating illegal fishing. Kehila Chadasha will start the day with its annual Green Raffle to benefit environmental nonprofits. They will auction off books about living a green lifestyle, gift certificates from local nurseries, and other items from our green storehouse of mugs and bags.

  • “What is the greater danger – nuclear warfare or the population explosion? The latter absolutely! To bring about nuclear war, someone has to DO something; someone has to press a button. To bring about destruction by overcrowding, mass starvation, anarchy, the destruction of our most cherished values-there is no need to do anything. We need only do nothing except what comes naturally – and breed. And how easy it is to do nothing…

    …Democracy cannot survive overpopulation. Human dignity cannot survive [overpopulation]. Convenience and decency cannot survive [overpopulation]. As you put more and more people onto the world, the value of life not only declines, it disappears…”

    -unknown (to me)

    But, I would add that overpopulation issues will cause nuclear war! Resource wars will escalate until finally someone decides that they are “forced” to nuke the enemy for their own survival.

  • I don’t understand why the starving masses in North Korea don’t just rush the borders – go North, go South, but get going!

  • @Pat says “I’m sure the FBI is monitoring the traffic on all the doom sites, whether they are “environmental whackos” with left leaning tendencies or anti-government right-wing extremists. They probably have all our IP addresses and know where we live, where we work, etc. They probably know how many guns we have, how much ammo we have, etc.”

    Your comment would be more accurate if you took out ‘probably’. There is no end to the large-scale data aggregation taking place at various fusion centers and who-knows-what else.

    Matched with cell phone records (in reality, voluntary personal tracking devices), physical & on-line purchasing history (the reason why cash is discouraged), education/work/licensing records, etc, etc, overall profiles are very complete.

    However, and this may seem strange coming from a pretty conservative thinker (in the sense that I see things in a very practical way as a numbers guy), I don’t think individual targets are their primary focus.

    The reason for this is from my old consulting days, where there was a little phrase called a “matrix of unmanageable proportions” in contrast to the tried-and-true KISS formula. IOW, while it’s possible to compile dossiers on 315m Americans, it’s practically impossible to assign a 1:1 or team:1 to specific individuals. (Unless, of course, they are obvious high-profile targets.)

    Rather, I think they are busy compiling statistical databases that will allow them to engage in predictive modeling. These models all have pre-sets incorporated into the flow charts, which allows them to quickly organize not only physical responses, but a whole host of psych, media, financial, etc controls.

    For example, given a complete data record of all movement on freeways, shipping lanes & trains, it would be very easy to have pre-defined choke points to achieve different objections: want to annoy/delay travelers or do you want to cut-off/restrict the flow of goods (eg food!).

    You can see how this is developing as they prepare for internal unrest. As I’ve said before, the name of the game is ‘continuity of government’ – the whole point is to ensure continuance of the state. It has nothing to do with what is taught, and what many people still believe, which is some kind of representation for the common good.

    It’s also why it doesn’t matter where you came from, whether the left or right. When you finally arrive, you can see how the entire con operates, which is why anyone who continues to reference traditional political identifiers still isn’t quite there yet.

  • B9K9:

    Yes, it’s become “Them” against “Us” as in TPTB and the rest of us. It seems TPTB are devoid of “right or left” ideology. You can tell who they are by their enemies!

    They are rulers, like pharaohs, emperors and kings, we will live by their grace. The best protection is to have nothing to plunder. The best rebellion is to be a drag on their expansion of wealth. So, do not pay their taxes, instead, live off their welfare.

    However, I would offer that NTE means we all go down. No need for a popular revolution – it’s like fighting for the captain’s chair on the Titanic.

  • copied from doomer website, don’t remember which one!

    The first thing to know about surviving the apocalypse is this: you’re not going to survive the apocalypse. You’re not special. If everyone dies? That includes you. If the ecological crisis that triggers the collapse (my money is on runaway global warming, personally) doesn’t get you, then the further militarization of our society probably will.

    If you want to survive, and I cannot express this strongly enough, you should not go run and hide in your little isolated cabin somewhere by yourself or with five of your friends! (Unless there are zombies.) If you simply retreat and wait for the world to right itself, you’re a coward and not even a very bright one; if you leave all of the work to other people, things aren’t going to come out so pretty. It is this sort of cowardice, this individualistic gusto, that arguably got us into this trouble in the first place. If you stand idly by and watch a fascistic army take control, you will, in the end, die. If you don’t try to organize with people to kickstart a permacultured agriculture to feed people, you will, in the end, die. If you live with two other people and never see another living soul again in your life? You might survive, but you might very well wish you hadn’t. When your appendix ruptures and whoops you forgot that your brother isn’t a surgeon? You will die.

    Like it or not, humans are social animals. Our best hope to stay alive, and furthermore, to thrive, after an apocalyptic event is to discover social solutions.

  • I doubt anyone fears a couple hundred computer-screen quarterbacks (this one barely manages to get out to the lot and plant a tree each week). We know the situation is hopeless, but we try to behave responsibly and we charge our little windmills and so what?

    I really can’t imagine what danger to THEIR survival we could be, just by virtue of being collapse-aware.

    It’s not like we’re dangerously fomenting collapse-awareness. We’ve all noticed how hard it is to convince family and friends that there is even a problem.

    Not that they don’t monitor and record everything and everybody they can. Modern technology makes it easy now. They can mine that data later if someone gets uppity or goes berserk. And there’s predictive modelling, as mentioned above.

  • Here is one newish theory, hypothesising our big brains were caused by the Earth’s orbital cycles!

    ‘Orbital dynamics, environmental heterogeneity, and the evolution of the human brain’

    It is behind a (steep), pay wall, but maybe Guy can still get it ‘free’, via old alumni contacts.

    Here is the Abstract:

    “Many explanations have been proposed for the evolution of our anomalously large brains, including social, ecological, and epiphenomenal hypotheses. Recently, an additional hypothesis has emerged, suggesting that advanced cognition and, by inference, increases in brain size, have been driven over evolutionary time by the need to deal with environmental complexity. The essential logic is that orbital variables have affected the quantity of solar energy reaching the earth, thus creating climatic changes that posed adaptive challenges to ancestral humans. Larger-brained humans were better equipped to deal with such changes, and proliferated accordingly, leading to the observed trajectory of increasing brain size. Though cross-citation remains rare, researchers from areas as apparently disparate as philosophy and botany are ultimately reaching similar conclusions. In order to test the validity of hypotheses linking encephalisation to climatic variability in the human lineage, the endocranial volumes of 180 fossil human skulls spanning the last 3.2 million years were collated from the literature and regressed upon a series of palaeoclimatic variables, including the amplitudes of the orbitally induced eccentricity, obliquity, and precession cycles. Multiple regression analyses demonstrate that the minimum amplitude of the eccentricity cycle explains 43% of the variance in endocranial capacity, with two further climatic variables accounting for a further 16%. These results are discussed in relation to the increasing weight of evidence that suggests that climatic instability may have played a significant part in the evolution of advanced cognition in both humans and other animals.”

    I just love this phrase..

    ‘linking encephalisation to climatic variability’

    I mean, that explains it all.

    Although it is a small size image, here is the JPG of the three orbital Earth-Sun cycles that produce Ice Ages from the article:

    It’s the Earth’s fault we are too smart for our own good !!! (not IMVHO that we are too smart for our own good.)

    But hang on, waaaaait just a minute?

    This means if it is all one big organism, whatever we call her Gaya, that entity, central intelligence agency, or being created that which is killing itself, or the life-forms on the surface/watery areas.

    That’s a it weird, why would it do that?

    Perhaps according to the Biblical accounts the second go that the God of the Hebrews tried was not us, it was the Neanderthals, and we just killed ’em quick, or rooted ’em out of existence. Nothing like sweeping them Neanderthals under the carpet hoping YWH wont notice.

    Precession, Obliquity and Eccentricity – they made us smart/dumb enough to do this mess…?

    I wonder, so understanding complexity requires us to get smarter, when we get smarter, we get so smart at understanding complexity we separate from natural cycles, and begin destroying life systems because we got dumber thinking we didn’t need those systems really.

    Sound complex?


    My own pet theory, if we go down this path of reasoning that bigger brains and higher cognitive ability got us here,(NTE), is that once we had bigger than usual tool making sized brains – say 1 million years ago – and could use fire and a stone hand axe(handle-less) , yes we got smarter, but it was a race to be smarter than the neighbouring group so you could bullshit them that much more, and be convincing, so you could exploit them. So we have bigger brains to be better con artists.

    Or my other pet one is that we did have to remember more stuff, or actually remembering more stuff was a group survival trait that kept getting selected for.

    So really when we invented hard copy, writing, we got dumber, and now we can store shitty blurry cat photos we will neve look at again into a hard drive.

    This leads to my other theory for why we have an epidemic of Alzheimer and Dementia in oldies.

    It is after Rupert Sheldrake’s Morphogenic fields theory.

    Well, there are so many more young people now, all downloading so much ‘memorable’ images, text and video, all of which , or most of which they have viewed. Instead of viewing and committing most to some human memory, even as remnant, that capacity is not trained in the youth so much. By weight of numbers, globally, this demographic are not renewing the Morphogenic field for that psychological function, and thus correspondingly everyone is losing the capacity to keep stuff stored up there, or wherever we do. The very old are weakest at this because they were of a generation that:
    1. Spent time reading with scrutiny, and it was a high order skill, (literacy and a culturally elite ability with big rewards), so it was a practiced art. Subsequently it has been a plagiarist’s art, and the guts and the grunt to sit and study text(i.e. read), is less desirable, and nerdy. (Who has the time to read?). So when I said from the beginning of writing it went downhill, this qualification applies here, that peak literacy has occurred, (even though it is still supposed to be a high objective even in Non-Anex-1 Nations). So once peak literacy is reached, globally, it becomes a passé youth culture, ideal, even business necessity, to shorten attention spans, even journalism is a crafty art of half plagiarism and 8 web stories per journo per day – divided attention or what?) and even the middle gens who acquired digital cameras, computer skills over their working life, like myself(now 50), have a foot in both camps.

    2. It takes brain power to recall memories that you do not have much emotional attachment to. Do you remember your first kiss,(Kathy C – you have been kissed haven’t you?), and I’m not referring to mum or dad kissing you goodnight, I mean your first romantic kiss? Of course you do. However, what was on the front page of the regular news cast/paper you read 3 days ago?, or the last silly image you viewed on a relatives digital camera/phone? Much harder to remember. So as much of the digital info, text, images, video, we see globally is pointless fluff, (cats on u-tube), then it gets forgotten, yes, gets stored somewhere on a electronic, or disc system, and has no emotional content. Short tem memory is still in the sorting out phase. You will really remember it if you make a determination soon, to remember it or not. If you need to remember stuff because you use it all the time, like Avogadro’s number – if you teach high school Physics, or dilated pupils are a bad sign for head trauma patients if you are a first responder paramedic, then it will move to permanent storage memory. Unlike so many generations of elders, modern life does not need their accumulated experiences for anyone’s immediate survival, or even great social advantage.
    Those days may come back, (very soon), but the knowledge just won’t be there, not the natural world Hunter Gatherer bits anyway. So the older folk do not keep the possible valuable experience, because no one(relatively speaking) is not valuing it. Now I have a caveat here too – some older people don’t know much worthy sage shit, because they were sucked in by the ‘Vegas ‘n’ Galwars’ approach, complete with poolside hipster music and holidays where you got wowed by seeing Hollywood up close. They just ‘enjoyed’ themselves, and never got chipped ‘enough’ by life to go deeper. I lived next door to a slew of these ‘types’, who slummed it in our district when they got displaced from their seaside condos as the rents increased. Many I would see at the local RSL slipping coins in the old one arm bandits.
    They are in contrast to others who have stories to tell of unshallow lakes in their past, where shipwrecks of the heart and risk taking love affairs made the own life come into focus for themselves to incarnate around. So some do have wisdom, both of the natural world kind and the very human trajectory of living a life of uncovered passion and desire for existential understanding if not release. So it varies perhaps, what elders, could contribute by age alone as a gauge, but having said that, I would never actually level that formed category onto someone by way of accusation, because it may just be wrong.
    3. have been techno surpassed, and can less and less apply old practices, like letter writing,( it takes so long to get there). One thing I learnt years ago when I romanticised the older hand tools used before electric power. I went to visit a very old man who was still making horse drawn carriages, and repairing the older ones. he was also a wheelwright, and new his old techniques, but I found he just used very modern tools when he could. A spoke shave still suffices but in most other situations it was gung ho. When I asked him why he didn’t use the older tools he said it took so much longer and it tired him out more. Go figure.
    So even oldies use email, if they can learn how to use them new-fangled confuser thangs. So even if the old ways were ok, they got scrubbed in many ways just by something being quicker and simpler(for the user, not neutral for the environment).

    Usually, even with stored numbers on phones, less need to remember stuff leads to less remembering, and by extension less use of short term memory to stabilise medium term memory, will lead to less Morphogenic field resonance integrity, and then after peak use it gets harder for everyone to remember.

    Now, what was I saying…?

  • B9K9

    Your points about TPTB only looking for the statistical and large scale dynamics with all the personalised data is not how I see it. That may be a use in addition to other personalised surveillance uses.

    BTW – A recent consumer practices TV show here on ABC pointed out that some large retail stores were getting into trouble because they were mailing new mother promotions items to teenage girls, because their software was predicting they young girls were pregnant, or about to get pregnant based on the overall recent previous purchasing choices. Some of those young girls were pregnant, and mum and dad didn’t know. Some of those young girls didn’t know they were pregnant either, until the pregnancy test promotional material arrived.

    But I digress. As we have seen with the convergent use of personalised data against the ‘significant nodal leaders’ of the Occupy movement, the data is there, and can be used to ‘globally’ analyse, and therefore, strategize how to neutralise the threats these individuals power to effect social change poses.

    In this case, there is a great number of strategies to withdraw someone’s motivation to continue participating in counter conformity activities, like which the Occupy movement have been agitating for – reduce wealth inequality, and increase wealth equality.

    That potential action by TPTB is best served in such cases as dissuasion through non-direct means, like financial ruin, fraud investigation, mortgage foreclosure, which seems random, but nevertheless, makes the choice that an individual makes feel disempowering, even shameful, and not an act of authoritarian police state intimidation. Should some persist, other options can be used.

    Knowing where someone is very likely to be on a habitual basis, is a very powerful level of surveillance information, especially when the storage of that digital information is not illegal if at the time it was collected it as not individualised.(D__k Ch___y is very sneaky) Once a person is identified, it can be ‘legal’ to data profile and collate all stored data, and thus target them.

    I recently read somewhere that if the Nazis had the personalised information that is available today no Jews would have survived Oil War II, (who were in the theatre of the war). The Nazis had compiled some very sophisticated demographic maps to work out who was where and all the information needed to know how, and in what forces, to deploy troops. It was a machine, well calibrated, to demonise, capture and kill.

    Something of such power as this very freely given, traded, bought and stolen, information in the wrong hands , + drones, is a threat too powerful to withstand even a popular social revolutionary uprising IMO.

    But the pieces are ‘falling’ into position, and we will only survive that ‘machine’ by some great fluke of circumstance.

    Any power gotten has always been used.

    I mean, can one imagine Cro-Magnons intelligently, democratically rejecting the use of fire, on the grounds of complex moral ambiguity -that it may lead to an unbalanced and dangerous undemocratic surveillance tribe, or the oppression and perhaps extermination of a subgroup hominids ?

    If you haven’t already, I suggest you read ‘The Trial’ by Franz Kafka, or ‘1984’ by George Orwell, to get an idea what TPTB, via the puppetry of the State apparatus, do to those who challenge their power, and supremacy they enjoy. Or just look at the potential fates of Bradley Manning, and Julian Assange.


    It would be naïve, IMO, to believe the industrial military finance complex just wants your personalised data to ultimately improve traffic flow, increase their marketing strategy, and save costs by personalised direct marketing, (pregnancy test kits – “Madam, our marketing team feels you might like to view these products we sell”)

    They even profile for those who just write anti government spiels on blogs, and differentiate which ones are highly likely to do more than just that. Did they join a group, a related club. Was any f that done outside their home, did they actually go somewhere to participate, etc. etc.

    Why has so much money has gone into ‘Network Theory’ in the last decade? A lot under the guise of ‘social networking research’, for obvious reasons.

    It is not just to find out how some thousands of fire-flies can synchronise flashing within a few seconds.

    ‘Network theory’

    The first researchers quickly realised there are critical individuals who proximal other individuals would follow, and reference. There were only a handful of these nodal individuals needed, who were also in contact, per several thousand.

    If these nodal human individuals were able to be identified, just by data, then as circumstances, like revolutionary social challenges to TPTB, eventuate, then those analytic tools, and strategies can be deployed to neutralise the nodal individuals, or alternatively locate agents into those nodal positions(BTW broadly …Politicians? Celebrities?) to dissuade the ‘followers’ from participating in ‘productive’ revolutionary ways.

    Know the enemy – in this case, centralised, ideological power, and avoid being seen in a surveillance state/world. They also model and profile for consistency of predictive behaviour.

    The only reward perhaps for being undisciplined and unpredictable could be survival in such dark times.

    But, like in those Jason Bourne stories, and spy movies, where the agent says to the novice, “…ok, you can never go back there, never” one may have to just do that regarding all your favourite locations. The data even extends to all those you have been near by frequency correlation to their voluntary GPS locator, as a probability number.

    Drones are heartless, but efficient.

    Very close to Minority Report and Precrime.

    Don’t be fooled, they are not after ‘you’, not yet. It all depends on what you do, and who listens to you. Don’t think fake facial hair and a trench-coat will cut it this time round.

    Don’t be a node dudes!!

  • be afraid, be very afraid!

  • Emotions usually are not good guides for assessing situations, but when taken with the facts on the ground, in this circumstance, they may not be completely baseless. My gut feeling is that this year is going to the one in which climate change will be manifest in many ways. We started off with an average winter temperature-wise but with far more snow than typical. Spring, however, has been very late in coming. A few weeks ago spring finally arrived and everything has burst to life. Tonight and tomorrow night the temperatures are going to drop into the 30s again potentially damaging many food producing plants.

    I realize that averages come from the compilation of extremes, but, as I said, it just feels different to me this year. Perhaps it’s my heightened sense of awareness; perhaps not. Last year when the heat was setting records in March, I knew it was going to be serious – and it was, but even so, this feels different. I’m wondering if this year will be the one that nothing goes as expected with respect to weather and we experience widespread crop failure.

  • Is it safe to pack away the snow shovel yet?
    @The REAL Dr. House
    Don’t fret, the nice lady on the weather channel said it is just mother nature’s way of balancing things out!(?) We have had more winter in the last two weeks than we had all winter. But it is a nice reprieve from the dust and pollen, so I’m not complaining. But I do have that same gut feeling, uneasiness, I guess, like always waiting for the other shoe to drop. Maybe that’s just what impending doom feels like?

  • Climate change: how a warming world is a threat to our food supplies
    Global warming is exacerbating political instability as tensions brought on by food insecurity rise. With research suggesting the issue can only get worse, we examine the risks around the world

  • Rob Says: However, I would offer that NTE means we all go down. No need for a popular revolution – it’s like fighting for the captain’s chair on the Titanic.

    Extinction’s a fate we’ll all share—
    That’s everyone, no matter where;
    We’re on the Titanic:
    Don’t bother to panic
    Or fight for the captain’s chair.

  • Btd – how well you pare the whole thing down. Problem with paring things down it you can’t get lost in the words. You have to face things up front. Extinction is everyone. What else is there to say?

  • Here’s a doozy of a paper, especially considering the source. I’m amazed that it is published by the USGS – even though it is completely self-contradictory, by implying our “exceptional brains” give us the ability to overcome genetically-programed selfishness…to somehow, outsmart evolution. It’s also naive, whether obtusely or for the sake of academic politics, because it assumes the catastrophes aren’t ALREADY occurring, as though

    1. the population isn’t already in overshoot and
    2. climate change isn’t already a fait accompli.

    But it’s not very long and worth perusal if only for amusement. Some excerpts:

    The Malthusian dynamic pushes a population to increase until it reaches its environmental limits. The Darwinian dynamic pushes against these limits by incorporating new traits and technologies that enhance survival and reproduction. There are restrictions to this Malthusian–Darwinian Dynamic (MDD), however: it is logically, physically, and biologically impossible for exponential growth to continue indefinitely within a finite world.

    Until now, both Malthusians and Cornucopians have been correct: some populations have crashed and cultures have vanished, but our species has endured because these events have been localized. However, behavioral changes and technological innovations over the last century now intricately interconnect us in a single global society. As a result, local perturbations currently have the ability to reverberate across all of humanity.

    …We must recognize that a sustainable future will ultimately require: (i) negative population growth for a number of generations, followed by zero growth; (ii) a steady-state economy based on sustainable use of renewable energy and material resources; and (iii) new social norms that favor the welfare of the entire global population over that of specific individuals and groups. It is also essential that we recognize that humanity has not yet evolved the genetic or cultural adaptations needed to accomplish these tasks.

    Our exceptional brains give us the ability to appreciate the present situation and envision alternate futures before catastrophe occurs. The challenge will be to facilitate a rapid cultural evolution that, for the good of the entire species, rewards individual sacrifices in fitness and quality of life. Genuine collaboration between natural and social scientists will be essential to inform society as a whole – and policy makers specifically – of this difficult but necessary adaptation required to accommodate our species in a finite and now full world.


    “He finds climate sceptics – led by a “little army of non-scientific, persuasive loony lords”, as he characterises them (a barely disguised reference to the former Conservative chancellor Lord Lawson and Ukip’s Lord Monckton, both of whom promote, to varying degrees, climate-sceptic views) – a frustrating ideological phenomenon. “They have profound beliefs – as opposed to knowledge – that they are willing to protect by all manner of psychological tricks. So you have people who are very smart – great analysts and hedge-fund managers – who on paper know that their argument is wrong, but who promote it fiercely because they are libertarians. Anyone with a brain knows that climate change needs governmental leadership, and they can smell this is bad news for their philosophy. They are using incredible ingenuity to steer their way around facts they do not choose to accept.”

    “More awkwardly, he insists his substantial investments in oil and gas don’t contradict his green views. “We need oil. If we took oil away tomorrow, civilisation ends. We can burn all the cheap, high-quality oil and gas, but if we mean to burn all the coal and any appreciable percentage of the tar sands, or even third-derivative, energy-intensive oil and gas, with ‘fracking’ for shale gas on the boundary, then we’re cooked, we’re done for.”

    This article gets optimistic, but that last sentence … he’s pretty much saying we’re doomed. He probably knows that we WILL burn every energy source we can. Is this guy my new hero, or just another rich a$$hole who’s found a new angle (or wants to shield his progeny from blame)?

  • BK9K states:

    “It’s also why it doesn’t matter where you came from, whether the left or right. When you finally arrive, you can see how the entire con operates, which is why anyone who continues to reference traditional political identifiers still isn’t quite there yet.”

    BK9K, the daft defender of realpolitik. So here you are yet again, attempting to guard your conservative moral nihilism, on a blog dedicated to green anarchy, otherwise a space for moral realists.

    One does wonder why you even bother. Why not take your own advice, and not make the effort. What are you hoping to instill in others, but complete indifference……even if it’s in context to NTE.

    So it makes no difference that the Right has opposed everything from women’s suffrage to civil rights to unionism to climate change. It doesn’t matter that the entire climate denial industry is solely a conservative institution. It doesn’t matter at all, that if we were to catalog the most loathsome of human qualities, that we would most likely be describing the average worldview of a conservative American male.

    You state, “when you finally arrive….”. You mean arrive at the place you are? In other words, arrive at callosity, devoid of any conflict, no sense of culpability, no sense of sadness, depression, guilt or grief. Arrive at the smugness of having never cared about anything other than yourself. You mean arrive at the very mindset of the ruling elite.

    Yet again, it’s just amazing that you can somehow imagine this magical final destination you speak of, as being something which has just eluded us, all this time, because we’ve been blinded by ideology, especially on the left. That we have somehow been ignorant of how power works, because we were driven by values instead of impassivity. That because we cared about the destruction of the natural world, we were/are somehow naively earnest.

    You struck me as repugnant with your first post, and you have shown nothing but contempt of this space ever since.

    What you obviously and continually display, is you’re devoid of empathy. Without it, you can’t possibly understand the choices others have made in their life, even in spite of the insurmountable odds.

    The risks, the challenges, the sacrifices others made because they happened to possess something called ethics is just lost on you. What you completely fail to comprehend, is the incredible effort others have made, to avoid where you are at, for it is nowhere, other than the easiest and laziest place to be.

    You clearly have never possessed any kind of moral imperative, which is why you are little more than a blowhard of amoralism.

    Would you please stop conflating your sense of political realism, with others sense of moral obligation. Please take your blithesome disregard elsewhere. I find it disgusting having to read others attempts to justify their neglect and apathy, when they’ve done nothing but profit from our collective annihilation of this world.

  • Josh and I say that we are hoping that the U.S. Supreme Court strikes down the opposition to gay marriage. But really, we’re hoping that we have enough food to eat this fall. Left or right, we all have to eat. Left or right, we’re all going to pay the price for the overshoot of our species. Left or right, when the shit hits the fan, we all go down together.

  • Emotions usually are not good guides for assessing situations, but when taken with the facts on the ground, in this circumstance, they may not be completely baseless.

    Gestalt originates at a deep place close to emotion, but is nurtured by extensive and intensive knowledge and understanding. Particularly so in fields where many disciplines coalesce.

    I have heard of a Chief of Emergency Medicine who while sitting at the desk and watching patients being brought into the Emergency Department, would accurately predict whether each patient would be admitted or sent home.

    There have been many instances in my experience of consultants who accurately managed (diagnosed + treated) patients in uncharted territory – conditions which were not even zebras. (The saying goes “If you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras”.)

    I have seen a carpenter who would make cuts in wood just by eyeballing it. When asked why, he said that measuring it would make him dependent on the measuring tape.

    Extensive and intensive knowledge and understanding are necessary but not sufficient to mastery.

  • @ Grateful

    Is this guy my new hero, or just another rich a$$hole who’s found a new angle (or wants to shield his progeny from blame)?

    Do you not listen to Guy’s lectures, or not hear what he says, or is it that you do not understand the information, or that you do not believe it ?

  • This blog has gotten SO much better since the introduction of the 2 posts a day rule! I hardly notice the antagonists anymore, thank you Guy!

    I came to the conclusion long ago that “left and right,” “democrat and republican,” “liberal and conservative,” etc, were useless terms. I still vote in every election, big and small, but I know my vote doesn’t really matter. TPTB have the whole thing figured out and their bureaucracy rules. Like I said in my earlier post, I find it interesting that there are right-wing doom sites that want many of the same things that the left-wing doom sites want. I’m sure these two camps could never get along, and, when industrial civilization collapses, they can figure out who “won” the ideological battle. The bad news is, when SHTF, both camps will probably be overrun by the marauding hordes with no ideology at all. Armed gangs of bandits will probably rule the day:

    Listen, and understand. They are out there. They can’t be bargained with. They can’t be reasoned with. They don’t feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And they absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead.

    From Noam Chomsky “If there was an observer on Mars, they would probably be amazed that we have survived this long. There are two problems for our species’ survival – nuclear war and environmental catastrophe – and we’re hurtling towards them. Knowingly. This hypothetical Martian would probably conclude that human beings were an evolutionary error.”

  • Jim Rawles, described as “the patron saint of survivalism,” subscribes to an isolationist, Christian-influenced approach.

    He homeschooled his children, declines to say where he lives, and advises readers of his website to “relocate to a safe area and live there year-round.”

    “When planning your retreat house, think: medieval castle,” he adds, extolling the benefits of using sandbags to protect any new home.

    Rawles, like many on the most conservative end of the survivalist spectrum, is also anti-tax, pro-gun rights, and suspicious of anything that smacks of socialism.

    But the survivalist movement also includes left-wing community activists, who are devoted to living off the land and have never fired a weapon, and people like Chris Martenson, who quit a job with a six-figure salary that he felt was “an unnecessary diversion from the real tasks at hand.”

    He began growing his own food and developed a “Crash Course” that urges people to better prepare for societal instability.

  • 28 min. video on
    Chemtrails, Geo-Engineering and Planetary Extinction

    give it a listen.

  • I’ve been invited to go to a “Do The Math: The Movie” screening on Sunday. Anyone want to offer me advice. Shall I tell them the only hope is ending industrial civ (and explain the consequences of that – such as that the nuclear power plant with no energy for cooling will go into meltdown and the fuel pools into blow up). Should I tell them that if the ice melts this summer its all over. Should I explain the methane time bomb. Maybe I should just listen and report the reactions of the group (have no idea how large it will be and what kinds of folks will be attending). Frankly I am afraid if I start talking at all I will blow a cork….. Help

  • Two different strains of anarchism were active in America in the nineteenth century: an immigrant tradition of insurrectionary anarchism, of the type promoted by Bakunin and Kropotkin, and an indigenous tradition of individual anarchism, sometimes known as Boston anarchism.

    Rooted in the American tradition of extreme individualism, practitioners of individual anarchism on both the right and the left condemned the state’s restriction of individual freedoms. The most well-known proponent of individual anarchism is Henry David Thoreau, whose technique of nonviolent noncooperation later inspired Mohandas Gandhi, Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., and Nelson Mandela.

    The immigrant tradition was far more visible, linked with acts of terrorism thanks to the actions of anarchists such as Alexander Berkman, who attempted to assassinate steel magnate Henry Clay Frick in 1892, and Leon Czolgosz, who assassinated President William McKinley in 1901. In 1903, Congress passed a law barring all foreign anarchists from entering or remaining in the country.

  • @Kathy C

    In addition to emphasizing that ending GlobCiv would be the only hope for the long run (if we could even do such a thing), I’d like to find out how they plan to get us from 397 ppm back to 350, and why they think even that level is safe (as in, it’s not)?

    Also remind them that it’s probably too late for any of these kinds of questions to make much if any difference to the human experience.

    Or you could tell them how the Second Law Of Thermodynamics makes a mockery of even the idea of human free will in this domain… 😉

  • Join in at http://www.350_dot_org/math

    The Do the Math Movie is being screened at house-parties and screenings across the country on April 21st. At 42 minutes, it tells the story of the rising movement to change the terrifying math of the climate crisis and fight the fossil fuel industry.

  • @Kathy C
    That is a great idea! Since you are probably familiar with their stance, maybe write out some pointed questions in advance, especially regarding the nuclear situation. The topic of ending industrial civ could be easily dismissed by a group as too out there (no offense to Dr. McPherson!!, just being practical to improve your chances of being heard and taken seriously.), but the reality of the nuclear situation cannot. You’ve already done your research, so maybe it could be a good chance to use you voice. I say go for it!

  • @ Rob, “fighting for the captain’s chair,” haha very clever!

    @Kathy, thanks. 🙂

    Kathy C says: I’ve been invited to go to a “Do The Math: The Movie” screening

    The inquisitive 350 sleuth
    Might conclude that you’re rude and uncouth,
    But why go halfway?
    Simply come out and say,
    “You can’t handle the truth.”

  • @ The Real Dr. House

    First off, I couldn’t agree with you more. In a post acceptance reality of NTE, the whole left/right divide is just as absurd as everything else. Trust me, I get that. On the days I have my NTE hat on, there is no point in placing blame, for we are all guilty. My mind, probably as with many here, drifts in and out of preponderance of time scales much larger than any political disparity. In a post acceptance paradigm, almost everything becomes anthropological.

    However, our NTE hats are quite new, and they surely aren’t very comfortable. Some day’s I take it off, and my entire life comes rushing back, where decades of activism asks the same damn question it has always asked: “How in the hell did we get here?” And as any long term environmentalist will tell you, we surely didn’t end up at nonlinear rates of climate change, because liberal egalitarian values have come to dominant the Washington Consensus.

    Climate Change, is and has always been, an intense political issue/war, where one side was incredibly right, and the other side was incredibly wrong, and that very divide, has had enormous consequences for all of life on earth……and those on the left have always known this to be true.

    I think this whole left/right debate is uncomfortable for many–including myself–because we all sense that to a huge degree, it’s all just water under the bridge at this point. For many of us, NTE is a very painful acquiesces.

    I believe we are all wrestling with a series of monumental decisions, where we are all torn between holding onto our past morality, and just throwing in the towel. And in a post acceptance reality, I can’t judge anyone for how they choose to either respond or not respond to this unbearable awareness.

    Nonetheless, in a pre-acceptant reality of NTE, there is a phenomenal amount of blame to be leveled, and conservatism–especially the culture conservatives–are deserving of almost all it. Especially, when it comes to environmental degradation and climate change, which just so happens to be the locus of NBL. For anyone to claim there is no difference between left/right is to have absolutely no understanding or awareness of decades of global activism, or even ecology for that matter.

    And while I suspect that you and I have very much to commiserate on in regards to “now what?”, there is just no way I’m going to sit quietly by, and let someone who claims irrelevancy of entrenched left and right value systems, continue to speak with a forked tongue, in feigning political agnosticism, all the while demeaning those who have been fighting for a more sustainable and equitable world all along.

    But other than, I hear you my friend……we’re all in this together now!

  • immigrant tradition of insurrectionary anarchism

    Insurrection involves coercive violence. Coercive violence shifts the paradigm into authoritarian hierarchy, away from anarchy and into oligarchy. Insurrection is oligarchy, however small and brief. Any resort to the initiation of coercive force excludes anarchy.

    Kathy C:
    Any information volunteered to the 350.orgers should be in the context of questions – if they allow questions. Contexts that they conveniently overlook. How will they deal with the choir of fat ladies (positive climate feedbacks) who have begun singing? How will they deal with the 400+ Fukes? How AND WHEN will they bring down the 397 ppm of CO2 to the much-vaunted 350 ppm so that it might be honest in name?

  • Oh please, does anyone care if the original agricultural civilizations that started this whole mess were democrat or republican? You can no more say the left is the champion of the activist movement than you can say the right is responsible for the plight of the world. Hogwash.

    There are plenty of bad apples in both camps. The spectrum is so wide with respect to these issues, it’s silly to even try to justify any position as “not as bad” or “better than” or “more or less” one thing or the other.

    As someone said before: NTE makes politics a moot point, so why debate it?

    I guarantee you if we could somehow rid the planet of 6 billion people and somehow safely dismantle the infrastructure today, you would get 6 billion votes AGAINST! Very few are going to volunteer to jump off the cliff to save humanity, left, right or in between.

  • Left and right. Not the same, but both inadequate.

  • I keep thinking about the “jumpers” from 911. These people jumped out of the building rather than burn to death.

    Well, the Earth is burning, anybody want to jump off?

    I’ve had aquariums for over 20 years, sometimes something goes wrong: air pump fails, heater sticks on, disease, whatever. Many times in these cases the fish are frantically trying to jump out, they don’t know that jumping out is certain death, but they are willing to do ANYTHING just to escape the current horror. As they say, jumping from the frying pan into the fire! The fish aren’t stupid, they just don’t know any better.

    In contrast, the 911 “jumpers” KNEW that jumping was certain death – it was just a better way to die.

    Hmmm, when your only option is “a better way to die” that’s truly the starkest of stark realities.

    So, does this mean we have to wait for the starkest of stark realities to dawn on us before people start jumping? I mean, we’ve seen what radiation sickness does to people, and I don’t recall large numbers of them killing themselves rather than go down slowly and painfully… I guess our tolerance for slow and painful is pretty high, and that’s bad news for planet Earth.

    You’re in a room with 8 people and there is only air for 6. You have a revolver with two bullets. Everyone sits on the floor, in a circle. You pass the revolver around. What happens?

  • @ Roger

    You state:

    “You can no more say the left is the champion of the activist movement than you can say the right is responsible for the plight of the world. Hogwash.”

    What a completely false and ridiculous statement, which flies in the face of……….I don’t know, how about the last half century of ecological study and activism for starters!!!

    What an amazing act of historical revisionism. So, there is no difference between regulation and deregulation. No difference at all between a carbon tax and completely denying climate change. All the rightwing think tanks have only been conspiring to reduce CO2 emissions all this time. The Koch brothers are but dye in the wool greens. There is no difference between Mountain top removal and wind farms. No difference at all between the Green Party and Libertarians? Socialism and corporatism share exactly the same policies. No difference between up and down, in and out, black and white, night and day, no such thing as binary opposition.

    So I can walk into any book store and pick up any book written over the last thirty years, in regards to the threat of climate change, and it’s just as likely to have been written by a conservative as a liberal?

    If you somehow can think that there is any truth in what you claim, I guess I would have to ask whether or not you can even read at all.

    What are you going to try and sell us next, Arizona beach front property? Because I’m sure you might “honestly” think you truly have some.

  • @ Ken Barrows


  • “This hypothetical Martian would probably conclude that human beings were an evolutionary error.” All species either were or will be an “evolutionary error”. It’s sort of foolish to expect “victory” or stability in this arena.

  • Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain – and most fools do.
    Benjamin Franklin

  • I’m just takin’ Homeland Security at it’s word: “If you see something, say something.” I see it – gotta say it.

    The student that said “Guy makes me think…” is offering the ultimate complement for any teacher. Makes sayin’ it worth while.

  • Nobody is arguing that the right is responsible for all the plight in the world.

    We are arguing that it is responsible for the plights it does cause, and so far all the right has ever done is passionately argue that it is immune to changing its behavior in response to criticism.

    Indeed, the right has NEVER apologized for ANYTHING since the days of Ancient Greece 2000 years ago when conservatives defended endless war traditions.

    I believe in blaming behavior that is blameworthy, not that the right causes everything. Don’t distort what is being said.

  • My great-grandfather was a very prominent right-wing politician in the US. Clearing out my mom’s house, my sister and I found one of his campaign buttons, which made the truculently succinct argument: “WHY CHANGE?”. We actually both had a laugh over it, though our politics are diametrically opposed.

  • If you want proof that the USA is now a full fledged police state, just check out Boston and surrounding areas – over a million people LOCKED DOWN by militarized police and SEARCHING HOUSE TO HOUSE ostensibly to find a teenager. 9000+ police, swat teams, FBI, etc combing the area can’t find the kid they pin the marathon bombings on – due to possibly photoshopped pictures of them walking around. Does anyone else feel like this is “just a drill” to see if they can get away with more and more repression, abandonment of privacy and rights, depriving over a million other people of LIFE!

    They closed down the fuckin’ HOSPITAL! So what if you were having a baby or cardiac arrest – “hey, tough shit pal, we gotta find dis kid, see” while a goddamn bazooka is stuck in yer face. (Not that i care but) they stopped a regularly scheduled baseball game (got it postponed) – you know how much money that’s gonna cost all the people involved in that (from the team to the vendors,etc)?;

    cancelled all air, rail and even cab service! Are you fuckin’ kidding me? That is some complete BULLSHIT. A few days ago i saw where a 4th grader brought home classwork on which was written “i am willing to give up some of my rights to feel safer.” (or something to that effect), which of course “outraged” the parents.

    And now this – on top of the Colorado theater shooting that we haven’t figured out yet, still no word regarding Sandy Hook, and on and on – they’re all startin’ to look like psy-ops to destroy (what’s left of)the bill of rights. i mean the rule of law DOESN’T APPLY to corporations, big banks, energy producers or the rich and powerful (or well-connected) – but to every one else it’s goddamn martial law!

    Everyone up there in MA is confinded to their cell, er, HOME until further notice?! Hey, chief – ya mind if i go to my DENTIST APPOINTMENT? Uh, sir, i’m scheduled in the OR for a cabbage, so can i go to my job before the guy dies on the table waiting for me to show up?
    i’m about fed up with this crap. Every week it’s something else now. And what kind of missle did they use on that Texas fertilizer plant explosion – look at the video! Of course it could be doctored, like everything else propaganda central doles out as “reality” on your tv set. They control the media people – they can do what they want, present whatever circumstantial evidence they want, and we can’t do anything about it! i saw some videos of this kid’s friends saying they couldn’t believe he’d do something like that – never said anything about any religious or political stuff, just livin’ his life. So after a few days the FBI and the rest of the goons get and idea to “close” this case by pinning it on two people who could be made to look like “terrorists” – FOREIGNERS (in other words, an easy sell to infantile Americans who watch too much television and always believe what they view without any CRITICAL THOUGHT).

    See what i’m sayin’? – IT’S POSSIBLE, and now with all this lock-down nonsense, it’s startin’ to look LIKELY that the real deal is the EFFECT of just invading a million people’s lives and putting them on hold BECAUSE THEY SAY SO, and they have the GUNS – they’re the LAW, see.

    i’m sure i’m just a paranoid delusional who’s “off his meds” or a “disgruntled” citizen or whatever. Sorry for the rant, please continue you day.

  • The joke in my old circle of friends was that ‘Conservatives’ don’t want to conserve anything,except their own bank account and their daughter’s virginity.

    But it’s true, ‘Conservatives’ have never conserved anything.

    The label should be stripped from them (maybe strip searched from them)

    ‘Conservatives’ believe in Growth and the Religion of Progress.

    Maybe they are Progressives.

    Roger @11:35 i.e. Jumpers


    For the Falling Man

    by Annie Farnsworth

    I see you again and again
    tumbling out of the sky,
    in your slate-grey suit and pressed white shirt.
    At first I thought you were debris
    from the explosion, maybe gray plaster wall
    or fuselage but then I realized
    that people were leaping.
    I know who you are, I know
    there’s more to you than just this image
    on the news, this ragdoll plummeting—
    I know you were someone’s lover, husband,
    daddy. Last night you read stories
    to your children, tucked them in, then curled into sleep
    next to your wife. Perhaps there was small
    sleepy talk of the future. Then,
    before your morning coffee had cooled
    you’d come to this; a choice between fire
    or falling.
    How feeble these words, billowing
    in this aftermath, how ineffectual
    this utterance of sorrow. We can see plainly
    it’s hopeless, even as the words trail from our mouths
    —but we can’t help ourselves—how I wish
    we could trade them for something
    that could really have caught you.

  • @ ulvfugl

    from wiki

    “…Typically, oceanic anoxic events last for under half a million years, before a full recovery….”

    Good news!

    Damn, I love a little light at the end of a very long tunnel!

  • Pat

    Great Terminator reference – ” Listen, and understand. They are out there. They can’t be bargained with. They can’t be reasoned with. They don’t feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And they absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead.”

    Is this the equivalent of Dearth Vader goading Like with:

    “It is your destiny”?

    If we actually frame speech, and attitudes that affirm an as yet unrealised destiny, it may add to it happening?

    James Cameron speaks about the Terminator as a modern symbol of Death, and everyone knows there is no bargaining with Death. So my interpretation of the Kyle Reese dialogue is about Death, and Sarah Connor, who it is spoken to, is also us, the industrial civ audience, so in the movie it does double as a wake up to the audience we are on a path to death, where humans are the impediment to the future existence of the ‘machine’ od Industrial Civ. Ironic, too, machines don’t die! Death is not a rite of passage, or a psycho-existential nodal metamorphosis point for machines like for humans.
    This dialogue, more than any other in the movie is what finally counters Sarah Connors 1980’s glib live for the moment pleasure lifestyle. It seems to me the message is to the audience too –

    “Wake up from all the passive entitlement to being served daily needs by the Industrial Civ. machine, it is about to bite you.”


    You wrote:

    “…On the days I have my NTE hat on, there is no point in placing blame, for we are all guilty….”

    With the hat thing I understand you are communicating that you have differing views on this subject, however, I disagree with the idea ‘we are all guilty’.

    I would like to explain.

    As ulvfugl has pointed out, most of us in Anex-1 nations(my definition not his ), did not choose the infrastructure embedded n the way of life we were born into. beurocrats and TPTB chose the polluting and destructive biosphere practices, loggers cut the trees, factory owners and manager discharged the toxic sludge into the rivers they were located next to for that very,(undisclosed), reason. These people actually are responsible for what they decide to do.

    One big problem with assigning blame or guilt onto all citizens is it tends to disempower individuals from acting in a different manner, because they calculate the small differences in their proposed lone actions, or even small group actions, against the masses of others doing BAU. The other issue with this POV is that is masks the very real, calculated and deliberate choices of TPTB to place profits over wider environmental concerns.
    The other aspect I wish to address is that in principle I agree with the concept of personal responsibility for aspects of environmental degradation. How it can be reasonably figured and calculated is an individual matter, between oneself and the land, sea, and sky. If one becomes sensitive to the non built environment, and the life and power of that living world, and thus ones inherent dependency upon its integrity, and safety(overall), then one will begin to see where each daily action, reasonably contributes to or not to the overall environmental degradation and collapse of living systems. Upon that deliberation it is possible to make significant changes to ones own habits and ‘lifestyle’ that reduces individual impacts on that degradation.

    Collective action can have bigger positive effects.

    So regarding individual ‘guilt’ or otherwise, I reject this reasoning, and see it is used widely as a background deliberate strategy to dissuade peoples motivation to change their habits, which undoubtedly would reduce unnecessary consumption, and reduce TPTB’ profits.
    I am not suggesting you are putting this view for that reason, just these are my reasons for holding a counter view.

    The more aware we become, the more we realise our integration in a vast array of living systems, and our small but nevertheless still active effects within those processes. The more aware we become, the better we can chose to live how we wish, rather than how we are induced to live by the circumstances of birth, family and culture.

    Kathy C

    Sometime back you put up how one could get to the last comment previously read on these pages so we wouldn’t have to scroll endlessly to find the latest comment. Can you please tell me how to do that once again?


    Seems like you are in the ‘test phase’ scenarios over there for how to manage a bigger and bigger lock down. The dentist appointment thing is a big issue. Magnify that and sector by sector industrial economic output will plummet – wait it is already down a heap, so maybe TPTB figure it is about the lowest ebb now, and it can only go to social unrest. If you get organised public transport corridors and movements, alongside armed military escorts to get to work shopping appointments, or stay indoors, then effectively it is a police state, no matter how ‘temporary’ it is said to be.

    You guys are being surveiled for all the data and searching online and phoning and emailing to see your reactions. It would be a big enough sample to see how to manage the whole deal at some time in the future, don’t you think.

    You write:

    “I’m about fed up with this crap.”

    What can you ‘do’ about it? If you communicate in any other way than by direct speech(out of sight of a camera), then it can be monitored. How can you legitimately collectivise any democratic resistance or assertion of rights?

    You cant, you are American, freedom is guaranteed in your constitution, then taken away by the Patriot act. We here in Australia are not far behind.

    Best of luck with all that inalienable right to freedom. As I have always felt, constitutional freedom is only a holding space to achieve lasting spiritual freedom, once your holding space is taken away, very little chance of the said spiritual freedom remains for a time.

    My thoughts go with you guys, and I hope all this gibber I wrote is incorrect, and it is only two deranged lone bombers, and a fertilizer factory accident, and a twin towers terrorist act and an Oklahoma mad guy bombing and a …..

    ….and not a huge, planned, centralised attempt to subjugate a no longer powerful economic nation of free people.

    A lot of effort has been made to craft the descriptive ‘terrorist’ label as fundamentally anti social in motivation. So when that label can be successfully applied to a scapegoat, who is in fact attempting to activate democratic rights, by civil disobedience, or collective peaceful public demonstrations, the trap is set and very difficult to get away from.

    I think the productive actions not to do your political action in the streets, or only as a very last resort. Talking about these issues in the course of daily life is probably too late a subversive act to work.

    The trap is too well set.

    The price of freedom is eternal vigilance. I’m thinking that the distractive nature of screen based leisure pursuits has succeeded in shifting that vigilance enough for freedom to have slipped away – even as a clear desire -for in a crisis, people will opt for ‘security’ over freedom.

    Your story of the school kid:

    ” A few days ago I saw where a 4th grader brought home classwork on which was written “I am willing to give up some of my rights to feel safer.” (or something to that effect), which of course “outraged” the parents.”….

    Sorry to say this, but … you guys ‘are’ fucked…..( er.. us too!!)because if this is happening those rights are already gone, the gate is already shut, the kids classwork is just closing the lath on the gate, telling the population what has already happened !!


  • Just can’t resist…

    ‘Kyle Reese Rages Against the Machine’

    Lookin’ a lot closer than when it came out in (Ironically) 1984!

  • Ozman, If you still have the blog up, try actually clicking somewhere on the last comment you read before updating. After the updating you should still be in the same place. If you are going to leave the NBL page, write down the time of the last comment ( like 6:53 pm) When you come back you can do Control F and then type in the time. Most likely only one or two posts will have that time stamp. You can use the DAte and time stamp or a phrase from the post as well – something unique like “Just can’t resist”.

    Thanks for the comments all on the 350 screening. That helps. Funny I should think I need help after all this blogging, but well in person is very different for me than on line. I guess a lot depends on what the film proposes is possible to do. And where the assembled group is at – perhaps the question I will raise is “What are you willing to give up in your life to prevent runaway global warming” and “If everyone did this would it be enough”. I really thank everyone who responded. Its helped me formulated a game plan that will probably disappear when the first stupid comment is made. 🙂 but better a plan than none

    After I came back from Haiti someone asked me if all the Carribean women were just naturally thin??? I started to try explain that no, the well off Haitian women were NOT THIN (besides being of the same ancestry as American Afro Americans), only the ones with not enough food, when my friend told me to stop spoiling the party. Slow burn….

  • KathyC, I just watched the trailer for the 350 Do the Math video at Climage Crocks. I hadn’t bothered until now because I’m very familiar with the 350 position and I know that they are only doing “half” the math – the other half (or more) being the amplifying feedbacks and the consumerism of industrial civilization and exponential growth of our population. And I’ve been disgusted with the cult of personality of the self-designated leaders of the Big Green NGO’s – even so I was taken aback by the adulation in the film. Ugh. This is the comment I left at CC which is crowd-sourcing funding for a trip to Greenland this summer:

    When are climate activists going to stop flying in airplanes? Air flight is not sustainable even if you want to subscribe to the fantasy that it’s possible to power industrial civilization for 7 billion people with so-called clean, renewable energy. It’s not just the fuel, of course. It’s all the pollution, and the other non-renewable resources that are finite.

    The larger question is when are climate activists going to stop pretending that it’s the big bad fossil fuel companies that are to blame when the real problem is the culture that trains people to be consumers of their products?

    When are climate ativists going to admit that in order for any life to survive on Earth, humanity is going to have to drastically reduce our population and curtail our so-called standard of living (or else Mother Nature is going to do it for us)?

    The emphasis on blaming fossil fuel corporations is about as productive as the epic failure of the war on drugs – like blaming heroin for drug addiction. It’s the addicts that need to be reformed.

    Until activists walk the walk instead of just talking the talk, they are merely providing fodder for deniers who scream “Al Gore is Fat” – Like this idiot!

  • @ Kathy C.

    I don’t know what’s said in the Do The Math movie, havn’t watched it. I get regular emails from, because I havn’t bothered to unsubscribe, but I delete without reading. It seemed a good idea when it began, and respected McKibben’s End of Nature bk, years ago, but as far as I can tell, what 350 are saying and believing is simply unrealistic. I don’t pay attention to them anymore.

    Firstly, the idea that they, or any, campaigning group is going to reduce ppm back to 350 is a fantasy, when the governments and corporations and bankers who have the power, have no intention of doing any such thing, and most of the world’s population don’t see the point. The time to do it was 30 years ago.

    We’re already almost at 400ppm and no sign of any serious moves to check the rate of increase, no known means of significantly reducing the levels, methane and other feedbacks likely to see the rates increase steadily if not dramatically, so the whole ‘get back to 350’ thing is tilting at windmills, and telling people that they are going to achieve something effective, is basically, telling a lie, which will leave them disappointed and disillusioned and hurt.

    However, assuming that their efforts have SOME effect, and reduce the rate of increase of CO2, then that’s good, I suppose, isn’t it ? I used to think so, once, that it was a good thing. If we could slow down, or delay the disaster, then that buys some time, to think, to invent measures, to transition….

    But now my view has changed, all of that is old thinking, no longer appropriate.

    The people still seem to be under the impression that if, by some magic, we can rewind the film, back to where we were, at 350ppm, then everything will be fine again. But that’s nonsense. Even if we could rewind back to pre-industrial, which I think was 280 ppm, we’ve still got total disaster.

    That’s because we have destabilised the system. The Holocene is gone. We don’t get it back, just by returning the CO2 levels to what they were. You know, once you set the ball rolling downhill, it keeps going, however much you shout at it, makes no difference. That’s what we’ve done. It’s going to take tens of thousands of years before it finds a new balance, and there is NOTHING we can do about that.

    Even if we have a revolution and collapse industrial soceity, even if it collapses itself because of a financial implosion or nuclear war or pandemic, or if we find a magic technofix that replaces coal and oil, the planet still keeps warming for many decades, because of what’s already in the pipeline, the sea level still keeps rising for centuries, the climate still remains chaotic forever, the stability we HAD has GONE, and cannot be retrieved.

    Afaik, Bill McKibben is not telling that to his followers. He’s still saying that if they do this or do that, then everything’s going to be more or less ok. That’s a LIE.

    It’s like talking to children, telling them that grandma is going to get better and then we’ll all go on holiday to the seaside, when you know grandma is going to be dead in the morning. Right, it’s good to be kind and sensitive to children, so white lies are appropriate, but adults need to understand reality so that they can make adult decisions.

    I wish you luck, talking to those people, and suggest you just tell them the truth, as you see it, same as you do here, same as I do here. Otherwise, what’s the point ? What they do then, with the info, how they react, is up to them. So long as you can back it up with empirical data, as Guy does, quoting reputable publications, then nobody can shoot you down, unless they disregard science and go the ‘global warming is a hoax’ route. Hard to know what to say to those people, isn’t it.

  • Tom, with respect to the various shooting/bombing events being staged as a way to implement martial law, a few years ago I would have dismissed such talk as paranoid delusions.

    However, now, either I’m becoming paranoid, or those ideas are really starting to make some sense. Of course, there are lots of crazy people in this world – and more of them will be manifest the more difficult life becomes over the next few decades, and there are lots of opportunists who will take advantage of every situation, but when I hear comments such as the following, it really makes me wonder:

    “Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC) called for denying the living suspect in the Boston Marathon bombings his Miranda Rights via Twitter on Friday.

    “If captured, I hope Administration will at least consider holding the Boston suspect as enemy combatant for intelligence gathering purposes,” Graham wrote, before continuing, “If the #Boston suspect has ties to overseas terror organizations he could be treasure trove of information.”

    He then wrote, “The last thing we may want to do is read Boston suspect Miranda Rights telling him to ‘remain silent.”

    So one of the most well known senators is advocating the suspension of Miranda rights. Just this once, of course, I’m sure.

    And from everything I’ve seen so far, there is no presumption of innocence at all. They already killed the older one, and the younger one is in the hospital in serious condition. A 19 year old kid.

    What I find really asinine is that the justification for killing the older brother (who has not been found guilty either, by the way), is that he was shooting at the cops. Yet, this legal justification comes from the very same people who are encouraging everyone to own an assault rifle. This is from an Arkansas legislator’s twitter account yesterday:

    Republican Rep. Nate Bell on Friday morning posted on Twitter: “I wonder how many Boston liberals spent the night cowering in their homes wishing they had an AR-15 with a hi-capacity magazine?”

    What better way to get rid of the backlog in the judicial system (or anyone who the government deems to be a problem): Arm everyone to the teeth. Then, when someone decides to protect themselves from jackbooted thugs kicking in the door in the middle of the night, the police are justified in killing the “suspect” on the spot in order to protect law enforcement personnel. Problem solved. No mess. No fuss.

    And then there’s this:
    U.S. attorney Carmen Ortiz said the government “had an opportunity” to invoke a public safety exemption allowing for limited interrogation of the suspect before he is read his Miranda rights.

    A “public safety exemption”. What the hell is that? Sounds to me like it’s one of those phrases that can be made to mean pretty much whatever they want it to mean to fit the desired outcome in any situation.

    Never mind that literally thousands upon thousands of law enforcement personnel were mobilized to find this guy. Again, one 19 year old kid, who for all we know was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. With that many gun totin’ testosterone raging puppets of the system running around, they couldn’t find a way to disarm the guy without shooting? Maybe it’s because as the aunt says, this was all a fabrication and those who did the fabricating need the alleged offenders out of the way.

    I don’t have any evidence of that theory other than my own supposition based on what I’m seeing, but it really does make one pause.

    On the other hand, I’ve believed for some time now that those in positions of power and authority have known for years what’s coming. To think that they wouldn’t be making moves to solidify their control and corral the populace would be naive. These actions certainly would be consistent with that. So, perhaps this is further evidence that the end is upon us. (As if those here needed further proof.)

  • maybe someone already posted this and I missed it…
    James Hansen Exaggeration, Jumping the Gun, and The Venus Syndrome

  • Good summary, U. Maybe Kathy could use some of that post starting with the grandmother part to set the tone…and be sure to wear a helmet.

  • white privilege and the Boston bombing:

    Not that I think random acts of terror – or the crazy, disproportionate reaction – matters much, other than being the embodiment of the classic side-shows of collapse, but I am curious if anyone has an opinion:

    If those 2 guys weren’t planning to be caught, why didn’t they put a little time and trouble into wearing a disguise? How much trouble can it be to buy a wig, shave your eyebrows, make a fake beard or wear a prosthetic nose? If not for the visuals caught on camera and the eyewitness ID, they might never have been found. In fact a bright white backwards baseball cap seems ridiculously outstanding and memorable. If they did mean to get caught, why run? Why not go online and make a public statement?

    All very bizarre.

  • @ulvfugl,

    A really excellent assessment of the state of affairs.

  • OTOH, Gail:

    Anderson Cooper acting all surprised a 19 year old didn’t have an “exit strategy,” like he’s never heard of Don Rumsfeld.
    — @jamisonfoser via Tweetbot for Mac